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 Post subject: HOWTO: Beat the AI
PostPosted: Mon May 31, 2004 5:07 pm 
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Sea Wolf
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Some people new to MA can often find the AI a challenge and wonder how to beat it in World War mode. Wonder no more! The attached file contains a replay of the AI being beaten on every World War map, once by the PL and once by the FNU. I didn't do "best case" replays, I played the AI once as PL and once as FNU on each map and used that recording. I never lost, indeed I don't think I ever lost an SA, and I never re-recorded to make myself look good. Actually, this is my first experience of both Brimstone and Wasserland.

I would rank myself as a fairly good MA player, and hopefully you will find these replays useful.

Stuck on the scenarios? HOWTO: Beat the Scenarios

Losing online? Quitch's Replays thread


Attachments:
File comment: Contains replays for beating the AI on every MA map using both sides
BeatingTheAI.zip [164.19 KiB]
Downloaded 1148 times

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Last edited by Quitch on Sun Jul 18, 2004 4:57 am, edited 5 times in total.
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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Jun 01, 2004 3:43 am 
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Sea Wolf
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To see games against the AI on Emerald in my early days, follow this link: http://massiveassault.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=623

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 30, 2004 6:46 pm 
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awsome work

thank you

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 30, 2004 6:49 pm 
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Sea Wolf
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I had done the same for all the scenarios, but under 204 they're a bit flaky so I'm waiting on the next patch before posting that.

Glad you like this.

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PostPosted: Thu Feb 17, 2005 8:33 am 
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Sea Wolf
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If someone wants to add to this with the equivilent for the new MAN maps then go for it. I don't have MAN so can't do those.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Mar 14, 2005 12:13 am 
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Conscript

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Location: Helsinki, Finland
Thanks for these. been trying desperately to beat the AI at least once but i always fall on my ass. =P i've been trying to find my errors and mistakes by watching my lose replay and thenyour win replay but it's bit hard to know what to look. On emerald i've got allies 3 in line and one to flank 1 neutral country. i know that this is some sort of dream placement for secret allies but i just don't know how to take my advantage from it.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Mar 15, 2005 6:53 am 
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Sea Wolf
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To beat the AI you simply need to master transports. The AI's movement is very slow, partly because it doesn't use transports, and partly because it uses Mortars and LAVs as an opening. Stay mobile. Having the bigger army doesn't matter, contrary to what some people who choose whether to resign based on the stats, think, if you can't target its firepower effectively. What matters is the ability to employ your entire army in a single turn, in a single arena. If your army is focused and mobile, where as the enemy is spread out and slow, you will decimate him.

The things to watch in my replays are mainly:

a) The way I use transports

b) My initial deployment

On the larger maps, try and focus on taking a single continent and merely delaying the AI on the others. Securing a continent on a large map (assuming it is of reasonable size) usually leads to victory, especially against the AI which doesn't use Naval Transports.

If you'd like me to try and recreate one of your SA layouts and go from there, I'd be more than happy to. Just name the map and the SA names... obviously if it's a larger map I might get fed up if it takes too long to generate the same setup, but I'll do my best.

Have you checked out the link above to my early day victories? Those will show you how I progress from my first, AI style victory, to using transports in ever more effective ways. Getting used to transports can take a few games, but they're the most powerful weapon you have.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Mar 15, 2005 8:52 am 
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Conscript

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Location: Helsinki, Finland
Ok. the SA placing is like this: 3 in row: Gloster Corwnland and pangoria.
The one seperated: predel


Attachments:
File comment: Tactical map to provide illustration.
disclose_ul.jpg
disclose_ul.jpg [ 9.87 KiB | Viewed 25175 times ]

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Mar 15, 2005 9:11 am 
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Sea Wolf
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Are you the FNU or the PL?

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Mar 15, 2005 9:25 am 
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Location: Helsinki, Finland
PL.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Mar 15, 2005 9:29 am 
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Sea Wolf
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I just tried about sixty times without success to get that combination.

I would declare your medium and the adjacent low. Place your medium troops on the eastern border, using three tanks, a transport and a bot. Declare the low behind it and deploy a transport, tank and bot.

Invade the neutral on the left and occupy the city, bringing the reinforcements from your low. Should the central low be an enemy, declare your isolated low and invade it from behind, otherwise I'd keep that low safe until you know where all the enemy SAs are.

Should the country you're about to invade turn out to be an enemy, aim to hold the border and divert your reinforcements to invading the central low, using declaring the third territory in the chain as a useful means of bringing in further troops.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Mar 15, 2005 12:02 pm 
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Sea Wolf
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I'm being dumb. Post me a save of the setup and then I can play through it.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Mar 15, 2005 2:44 pm 
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Sea Wolf

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i'd disclose the medium with units on the left border and the low on the far right placing the units on the birder with the neutral medium. Then the undisclosed sa in your grp of 3 can be used to support whichever country needs it.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Mar 15, 2005 3:46 pm 
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Sea Wolf
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No way, invading that top right medium from the low, through a narrow pass filled with trees, in a territory which they can fortify a tower in a one hex wide pass, is suicide. Keep that country in case they declare the medium to invade from behind YOU, then the low can hold them there for the rest of eternity.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Mar 15, 2005 6:47 pm 
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Sea Wolf

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unless they invade on turn 1, then u're screwed.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Mar 16, 2005 1:03 pm 
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Sea Wolf
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If you're FNU and you deploy merely to anticipate every PL attack then you've already lost. At some point you have to attack, and if you've handed the PL the initiative on a platter then you lose.

It's not that common to see that Medium declared to attack that territory anyway. It's hard to bring reinforcements to. If the enemy owns both lows (as we see here), the troops from the medium can be driven back and contained easily.

The possibility wouldn't keep me awake at night, that's for sure.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Mar 16, 2005 2:36 pm 
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Sea Wolf
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Here's that replay you wanted Mooneri. I assume you had the AI set to Medium? Or was it Easy? This replay may show me as a bit rusty, but going into the game expecting the usual Hard combo of LAVs and Mortars followed later by tanks and the odd bot, the deployments of the AI continued to surprise me.

In fact, had this been Hard I wouldn't have had any problems, but as we see here, I get into a bit of a mess at one point, in part due to my expecting one plan when the AI goes for another, and also because my opening deployment was flawed.

The AIs play showed my initial choice of invasion was poor. I should have pushed into the middle, thus linking all my territories, and neatly avoiding the mess I get myself into, solely because I am unable to get reinforcements to my isolated territory.

It's not quite as bad as it seems. Had things become really urgent I'd have invaded the central low earlier, but as it is I am able to drag things out a bit up North, and my rapid troop movement quickly turns the tide.

Less one-sided than my Hard replays. Maybe I should do a set for each difficulty? :)

Take heart, I recall that it was remarked upon during the days of the demo that the Hard AI wasn't the most difficult of the three levels to beat on Emerald, due to the difference in unit choices between the levels.


Attachments:
File comment: Winning under Mooneri's setup
0-EME-Quitch(W)-AI(L)-9.rep [31.96 KiB]
Downloaded 864 times

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Mar 17, 2005 12:18 am 
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Conscript

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Location: Helsinki, Finland
thank you so much. if u'd live here i'd buy a beer and a stake :D Now i start to see my errors in play. My biggest tripping stone is the use of transports and invading. One plan i tried was that i invaded the neutral between SA:s To create a linked country line to make it harder for him to invade them. But In this tactic i had a flaw. A big flaw. enemy invaded the neutral next to me and i couldn't hold him back from my back. So i was flanked, invaded he got indemnity, renevue and i lost. Fighting war on two opposite fronts is pretty hard i see :wink: (when i wrote this i got tons of ideas what should be done to win a game against AI.)

Thank you again Quitch for taking time to help me. I appreciate it.

(Summary: I just need to practise more and more and watch closely for any gaps in enemy lines to exploit. <- another "thing" hard for me-)

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Mar 17, 2005 8:00 am 
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Sea Wolf
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Normally two fronts against the AI isn't too hard, you can slowly fall back. What got me was because he went for Rocket Launchers, this didn't work as the territory I was in was filled with roads, so he could easily catch and destroy me.

Thus we fall to plan B, the one you tend to use against humans. You destroy what you can, position to limit the damage he can do, and try to hold the capital if it will buy you a turn.

And the isolated territory still did its job by preventing him getting resources from the ridge territory (never did learn the names), destroying the RL that might have harmed my invasion, and held out just long enough for me to reinforce.

I took back my territory a turn later than I could have, of which I'm very ashamed. I point to that as proof of my rustiness :)

It's a pleasure to have helped. Don't be afraid to post if you have any more problems. Invading the central Low is IMO the way to go here. You link your territories, threaten the AIs flank...

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Mar 18, 2005 11:28 am 
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Conscript

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Most surely will!

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